{"id":2558,"date":"2025-10-21T22:26:48","date_gmt":"2025-10-21T19:26:48","guid":{"rendered":"https:\/\/an.magicworld.com.ua\/?p=2558"},"modified":"2025-10-21T23:05:46","modified_gmt":"2025-10-21T20:05:46","slug":"rozmova-z-petrom-magoyu","status":"publish","type":"post","link":"https:\/\/an.magicworld.com.ua\/en\/interview\/rozmova-z-petrom-magoyu\/","title":{"rendered":"Conversation with Petro Maha"},"content":{"rendered":"\n<p class=\"wp-block-paragraph\"><a href=\"https:\/\/creators.spotify.com\/pod\/profile\/magicworld\/embed\/episodes\/--e38112q\/a-ac59hi1\"> <\/a><\/p>\n\n\n\n<figure class=\"wp-block-embed is-type-rich is-provider-spotify wp-block-embed-spotify wp-embed-aspect-21-9 wp-has-aspect-ratio\"><div class=\"wp-block-embed__wrapper\">\n<iframe title=\"Spotify Embed: Petro Maga on Ukrainian self-expression, preserving identity, and culture \u2734 Archetype of the Nation\" style=\"border-radius: 12px\" width=\"100%\" height=\"152\" frameborder=\"0\" allowfullscreen allow=\"autoplay; clipboard-write; encrypted-media; fullscreen; picture-in-picture\" loading=\"lazy\" src=\"https:\/\/open.spotify.com\/embed\/episode\/4mfxViTWEsllkUV6zaHMDA?si=B7X2IwgbRd6dYWV1p2AbyQ&#038;utm_source=oembed\"><\/iframe>\n<\/div><\/figure>\n\n\n\n<blockquote class=\"wp-block-quote is-layout-flow wp-block-quote-is-layout-flow\">\n<p class=\"wp-block-paragraph\">Guest of the episode: Petro Maha \u2014 Ukrainian People\u2019s Artist, poet, and television host. <\/p>\n<\/blockquote>\n\n\n\n<figure class=\"wp-block-embed is-type-video is-provider-youtube wp-block-embed-youtube wp-embed-aspect-16-9 wp-has-aspect-ratio\"><div class=\"wp-block-embed__wrapper\">\n<iframe loading=\"lazy\" title=\"Petro Maga on Ukrainian self-expression, preserving identity, and culture \u2734 Archetype of the Nation\" width=\"1102\" height=\"620\" src=\"https:\/\/www.youtube.com\/embed\/DNgqWnlFL9Q?feature=oembed\" frameborder=\"0\" allow=\"accelerometer; autoplay; clipboard-write; encrypted-media; gyroscope; picture-in-picture; web-share\" referrerpolicy=\"strict-origin-when-cross-origin\" allowfullscreen><\/iframe>\n<\/div><\/figure>\n\n\n\n<h2 class=\"wp-block-heading\">Transcript of conversations<\/h2>\n\n\n\n<p class=\"wp-block-paragraph\"><\/p>\n\n\n\n<p class=\"wp-block-paragraph\"><strong>Nik Lysytskiy:<\/strong> Hello, I\u2019m Nik Lysytskiy, and this is &#8220;Archetype of the Nation&#8221; \u2014 a cultural project that explores the foundations of Ukrainian national identity: who we were, who we have become, what we have, and what we can be. We search for answers in folklore and through conversations with prominent representatives of our nation.<\/p>\n\n\n\n<p class=\"wp-block-paragraph\">Today, our guest is People\u2019s Artist of Ukraine, poet, and television host Petro Maha. Good afternoon, Mr. Petro.<\/p>\n\n\n\n<p class=\"wp-block-paragraph\"><strong>Petro Maha:<\/strong> Good afternoon.<\/p>\n\n\n\n<p class=\"wp-block-paragraph\"><strong>Nik Lysytskiy:<\/strong>  Each episode of our project is dedicated to a certain value that defines the Ukrainian nation \u2014 one of the elements of our identity. Today, I\u2019d like to invite you to talk about a value we call self-expression.<\/p>\n\n\n\n<p class=\"wp-block-paragraph\">While preparing for this episode, we looked into how self-expression is represented in Ukrainian folklore. Here\u2019s what we found: for centuries, Ukrainians have been searching for and finding ways to express themselves. In traditional songs and prose, they expressed not only the individual but also the collective \u2014 memory, pain, joy, and hope \u2014 transforming even traumatic experiences into symbols, melodies, and images.<\/p>\n\n\n\n<p class=\"wp-block-paragraph\">To be unique, not part of the system, is a natural desire of a Ukrainian \u2014 someone with creativity and a drive for individuality. Mr. Petro, do you agree with this statement? And what does self-expression mean to you personally?<\/p>\n\n\n\n<p class=\"wp-block-paragraph\"><strong>Petro Maha:<\/strong> You\u2019ve touched on a very complex topic. On the surface, it may seem simple \u2014 we have beautiful songs, we sing about mountains, about happiness, and 90% of our songs begin with \u201coh.\u201d But that \u201coh\u201d can mean many things \u2014 \u201coh!\u201d or \u201coh, there!\u201d In fact, self-expression isn\u2019t only about songs.<\/p>\n\n\n\n<p class=\"wp-block-paragraph\">It shows up in so many other things \u2014 in woodcarving, in architecture, in the way a home was arranged. You know, once a British traveler wrote that he would rather eat off the floor in a Ukrainian peasant\u2019s hut than from the table of a Russian nobleman. Because the Ukrainian hut had to be whitewashed, well-kept, surrounded by hollyhocks and a tidy fence with a walkway. It had to be a personal space. A Ukrainian was a homeowner \u2014 with his own livestock, farm, and order \u2014 and even herding was done collectively. Isn\u2019t that a form of self-expression?<\/p>\n\n\n\n<p class=\"wp-block-paragraph\">When people gathered and decided: today you\u2019ll herd, tomorrow I will, the day after, someone else \u2014 isn\u2019t that self-expression too?<\/p>\n\n\n\n<p class=\"wp-block-paragraph\">And painted clay jugs \u2014 each one unique \u2014 isn\u2019t that self-expression? I have something rare at home \u2014 I bought it for almost nothing \u2014 a jug called a \u201csmoky\u201d one. Smoky jugs are black earthenware vessels made in kilns that held the smoke inside.<\/p>\n\n\n\n<p class=\"wp-block-paragraph\">There was a place in a village in the Chernihiv region that people thought was cursed because a house had burned down there once. No one wanted to buy that land. Finally, someone did, decided to build, and when they dismantled the old foundation, they found a kiln \u2014 it had been a potter\u2019s house. Inside were 130 jugs that had been waiting there for almost 200 years until someone finally brought them out.<\/p>\n\n\n\n<p class=\"wp-block-paragraph\">People didn\u2019t understand their value \u2014 this jug, with a lid that rings when you tap it, had been sitting in that kiln for two centuries, waiting to be discovered. And where else in the world can you find something like that?<\/p>\n\n\n\n<p class=\"wp-block-paragraph\">I\u2019m not even mentioning the fact that they say we have the richest song heritage in existence.<\/p>\n\n\n\n<p class=\"wp-block-paragraph\">What scares me is that we\u2019re forgetting all of this. Today, one of the main forms of self-expression is the Internet \u2014 where anyone can pour out their negativity, frustration, or anger. And I\u2019m one of those completely abnormal people who, if I see that someone has written a good book, I have to call them, or write to them, or meet and tell them.<\/p>\n\n\n\n<p class=\"wp-block-paragraph\">I\u2019m genuinely happy when I see someone create something good \u2014 if someone writes a great song, I\u2019ll be there to support it. But there are also those who only produce, forgive me, garbage. Just crap.<\/p>\n\n\n\n<p class=\"wp-block-paragraph\">And I want to remind them where this comes from, and what kind of energy they\u2019re spreading. You know that saying \u2014 \u201cIf only your family knew before\u2026 you\u2019re an idiot\u201d? Well, now, thanks to the Internet, everyone knows what\u2019s going on in your head.<\/p>\n\n\n\n<p class=\"wp-block-paragraph\">And the war has made it even worse. For many, national self-expression today, unfortunately, comes down to four letters \u2014 \u201cshit.\u201d That\u2019s a terrible problem. The reasons can be many \u2014 language, religion, even the question of defending your homeland or not.<\/p>\n\n\n\n<p class=\"wp-block-paragraph\">How can someone choose <em>not<\/em> to defend their own homeland? Even that is a form of self-expression. But within that, a lot of opportunism has appeared \u2014 what I call \u201cBayraktarism.\u201d<\/p>\n\n\n\n<p class=\"wp-block-paragraph\">I remember when the Maidan happened and the Heavenly Hundred were killed. I was terrified when, at the next song festival, the first ten songs were all about tragedy \u2014 \u201cThe Heavenly Hundred, you were killed, you were buried\u2026\u201d and so on. It turned into fierce speculation on pain and grief.<\/p>\n\n\n\n<p class=\"wp-block-paragraph\">If you say to someone now, \u201cThe duck is floating\u201d \u2014 the line from that old folk song \u2014 they\u2019ll shiver, because they remember the first fallen being carried out to that melody. But when it started to be played everywhere, I began to feel fear in my own body \u2014 the same fear I feel when I hear \u201cGlory to Ukraine.\u201d<\/p>\n\n\n\n<p class=\"wp-block-paragraph\">I don\u2019t want that phrase \u2014 sacred to me \u2014 to become an empty slogan, like \u201cGlory to the Communist Party.\u201d<\/p>\n\n\n\n<p class=\"wp-block-paragraph\">Because the phrase \u201cGlory to Ukraine,\u201d which has become part of our self-expression, is a great one \u2014 it has echoed not only in Ukraine but around the world. Yet when some pop singer finishes a performance, shouts \u201cGlory to Ukraine,\u201d and people look at each other thinking, \u201cWhy? What for? Where were you before?\u201d \u2014 it loses its meaning.<\/p>\n\n\n\n<p class=\"wp-block-paragraph\">I believe that when soldiers who defend us say it, or their families, or at a memorial event \u2014 that\u2019s when it\u2019s appropriate. But otherwise, just as you don\u2019t throw God\u2019s name around carelessly, you shouldn\u2019t throw this phrase around either.<\/p>\n\n\n\n<p class=\"wp-block-paragraph\">So, returning to the idea of unique Ukrainian things \u2014 I think all we really need to do is highlight them and show them to the world. They\u2019re self-sufficient.<\/p>\n\n\n\n<p class=\"wp-block-paragraph\">When you hear an authentic song \u2014 like \u201cOh, the girl went to fetch water\u201d \u2014 sung by elderly women in a village ensemble, most of them over eighty, you can hear the tears in your eyes. It\u2019s something real, alive.<\/p>\n\n\n\n<p class=\"wp-block-paragraph\">But when young girls come out in short, \u201cstylized\u201d skirts, thinking it\u2019s modern, mixing things that don\u2019t belong together and turning it all into vulgarity \u2014 I realize we\u2019re not moving forward in many ways. It all begins with school. And even earlier \u2014 with the family.<\/p>\n\n\n\n<p class=\"wp-block-paragraph\">And who is the family? The people who instill in a child what they themselves know. But if they don\u2019t know anything \u2014 then what can they pass on?<\/p>\n\n\n\n<p class=\"wp-block-paragraph\">So tell me \u2014 which is older: the yin-yang symbol in China, or the Trypillian culture?<\/p>\n\n\n\n<p class=\"wp-block-paragraph\"><strong>Nik Lysytskiy:<\/strong> Well, as far as I know, the Trypillian culture\u2026<\/p>\n\n\n\n<p class=\"wp-block-paragraph\"><strong>Petro Maha:<\/strong> And what about the yin-yang symbol we see on every other stone?<\/p>\n\n\n\n<p class=\"wp-block-paragraph\"><strong>Nik Lysytskiy:<\/strong>  And not just yin-yang.<\/p>\n\n\n\n<p class=\"wp-block-paragraph\"><strong>Petro Maha:<\/strong> Exactly. And why do I emphasize this? Because the clever Chinese declared that their yin-yang symbol is around two thousand years old \u2014 yet it was actually found on stones from the Trypillian culture.<\/p>\n\n\n\n<p class=\"wp-block-paragraph\">I wish Viktor Andriiovych Yushchenko were here \u2014 he\u2019s an expert, a real enthusiast. I once saw him buying Trypillian pottery shards. He told me, \u201cI paid a ridiculous amount for them.\u201d I asked, \u201cWhat is it?\u201d and he said, \u201cI bought some shards for 300 dollars.\u201d<\/p>\n\n\n\n<p class=\"wp-block-paragraph\">I asked, \u201cWhy?\u201d And he said, \u201cI don\u2019t know if they\u2019re all from one vessel, but the sellers swear they are.\u201d When he had free time at work, he would piece them together. Eventually, he reconstructed this huge jug \u2014 with yin-yang symbols on both sides, just a little stretched. It\u2019s about three and a half thousand years old. The Chinese, meanwhile, bring in tens of millions of tourists and make fortunes from such finds.<\/p>\n\n\n\n<p class=\"wp-block-paragraph\">And here, when people discover the foundations of Trypillian houses, they quietly destroy them \u2014 plow over them, break them with tractors because they need to sow the fields. It terrifies me. We have such a deep culture, such heritage, and yet Ukraine remains misunderstood.<\/p>\n\n\n\n<p class=\"wp-block-paragraph\">People have often said: embroidery from the Ivano-Frankivsk (formerly Stanislav) region looks completely different from that in Chernihiv or Poltava \u2014 you could tell them apart instantly. But have you ever wondered why the same musical instruments or similar designs appear in completely different parts of the world?<\/p>\n\n\n\n<p class=\"wp-block-paragraph\">For instance, those crossbody bags \u2014 the ones you throw over your shoulder while riding horses \u2014 they exist among the Hutsuls and the Ecuadorians, the Chileans, the Peruvians. Mountain people and mountain people. Their embroideries are strikingly similar, their ornaments almost identical.<\/p>\n\n\n\n<p class=\"wp-block-paragraph\">Both cultures have <em>gerdans<\/em> (beaded necklaces). Both have the <em>drymba<\/em> (Jew\u2019s harp). The northern peoples \u2014 the Hutsuls \u2014 have it, too. Both have the pan flute: in Latin America it\u2019s called the <em>zampo\u00f1a<\/em>, elsewhere the pan flute, in Moldova it\u2019s common, and the Romanians are considered the best players. They call it \u201cGod\u2019s providence.\u201d<\/p>\n\n\n\n<p class=\"wp-block-paragraph\">And now, because of the war, Ukraine has suddenly become a global trend. But when we win, I want us to remove that bloody element \u2014 the pain, the suffering, the demographic tragedy that awaits us \u2014 and instead bring forth a great flowering, a chorus of what we might call Ukrainian self-expression. That\u2019s what I believe in.<\/p>\n\n\n\n<p class=\"wp-block-paragraph\"><strong>Nik Lysytskiy:<\/strong>  And, of course, subscribe to our channels and pages so you don\u2019t miss anything interesting \u2014 all the links are in the description. Today, we\u2019ll actually talk about the Internet and the difference between self-expression and the market.<\/p>\n\n\n\n<p class=\"wp-block-paragraph\">But first, I\u2019d like to touch on something more personal \u2014 to understand, through the example of one creative person, how a boy from a small Transcarpathian village became a People\u2019s Artist of Ukraine, a theater director, a general producer, a well-known poet and songwriter. How did that journey begin? You once mentioned that you first stepped on stage at the age of five.<\/p>\n\n\n\n<p class=\"wp-block-paragraph\"><strong>Petro Maha:<\/strong> Yes \u2014 and I didn\u2019t just step on stage, I fell right off it.<\/p>\n\n\n\n<p class=\"wp-block-paragraph\"><strong>Nik Lysytskiy:<\/strong>  Do you remember what you felt in that moment?<\/p>\n\n\n\n<p class=\"wp-block-paragraph\"><strong>Petro Maha:<\/strong> I do. I went out there filled with defiance. I grew up in a completely anti-Soviet family.<\/p>\n\n\n\n<p class=\"wp-block-paragraph\">My grandfather was a very wealthy man. He had spent 17 years working in America before returning to Ukraine, buying land, and becoming a farmer. But when the Soviet regime came in 1944, everything changed. He was sent away \u2014 first to Vyazma, then to Magadan, then to Vologda, which was a closed prison. His last place of imprisonment was a town called Buy.<\/p>\n\n\n\n<p class=\"wp-block-paragraph\">I don\u2019t even remember which region that was. It was a political prison camp. And he returned home only after Stalin\u2019s death.<\/p>\n\n\n\n<p class=\"wp-block-paragraph\">At home, anything that had to do with Moscow or with winter holidays was taken very harshly by my grandmother. She had raised four sons on her own. I remember there was some Soviet holiday \u2014 the so-called \u201cDay of the Unification of Ukraine and Russia.\u201d When it came on the radio, my grandmother would always say, \u201cTurn off that garbage.\u201d<\/p>\n\n\n\n<p class=\"wp-block-paragraph\">So I knew that song was bad. And then, one day at the village club, they started performing it \u2014 a full choir singing it from the stage. I climbed up on stage, to everyone\u2019s laughter, tugged at the accordion player\u2019s sleeve, and said, \u201cWait, this is a bad song!\u201d She looked at me and asked, \u201cAnd which one is good then?\u201d<\/p>\n\n\n\n<p class=\"wp-block-paragraph\">So I started singing a parody of the Slovak anthem \u2014 with words that went something like, \u201cI forced the communists to die, the Slovaks will come to life.\u201d Meaning, we swear that all communists will die, and Slovaks will rise again. For that, we could have been in serious trouble.<\/p>\n\n\n\n<p class=\"wp-block-paragraph\"><strong>Nik Lysytskiy:<\/strong>  At five years old?<\/p>\n\n\n\n<p class=\"wp-block-paragraph\"><strong>Petro Maha:<\/strong> Yes. My father, pale as a wall, ran onto the stage, grabbed me under the arm, and carried me down. I was still singing something on the way, out of protest, while everyone was laughing. But they all knew there were a couple of informers in the village \u2014 so at home, they wanted to give me a little \u201clesson.\u201d<\/p>\n\n\n\n<p class=\"wp-block-paragraph\">Back then, \u201cpsychologists\u201d came in the form of what we called the car hose, the power cable, or the skipping rope \u2014 very \u201ctherapeutic\u201d tools. But my grandmother defended me, saying I\u2019d sung a very nice song.<\/p>\n\n\n\n<p class=\"wp-block-paragraph\"><strong>Nik Lysytskiy:<\/strong>  Your self-expression was appreciated.<\/p>\n\n\n\n<p class=\"wp-block-paragraph\"><strong>Petro Maha:<\/strong> Yes \u2014 though it had to be \u201ccorrected.\u201d And if I didn\u2019t sit properly at the table, I had to hold on tight.<\/p>\n\n\n\n<p class=\"wp-block-paragraph\">At the next concert, they gave me a poem to recite about the Chilean junta. I still remember some lines: \u201cJuan and Vicente\u2026 Then the children of Mireya and Pablo Sarmiento\u2026 The policemen broke into their house at night. And father said, \u2018Get ready, we\u2019re going.\u2019 Every day and every night in prison they beat him, but they couldn\u2019t break Sarmiento\u2019s will.\u201d<\/p>\n\n\n\n<p class=\"wp-block-paragraph\">Can you imagine \u2014 sending a five-year-old child, who has no idea what\u2019s green and what\u2019s red, to perform that? But somehow, that\u2019s how I was \u201crehabilitated.\u201d And as my mother says, once I pushed myself onto the stage, no one\u2019s been able to push me off it since.<\/p>\n\n\n\n<p class=\"wp-block-paragraph\"><strong>Nik Lysytskiy:<\/strong>  And when did you write your first poem?<\/p>\n\n\n\n<p class=\"wp-block-paragraph\"><strong>Petro Maha:<\/strong> Oh, I was probably eight or nine. It was a poem in Russian \u2014 about an icebreaker. I saw some TV program and wrote it afterward. It\u2019s one of those \u201cGod, how embarrassing\u201d moments.<\/p>\n\n\n\n<p class=\"wp-block-paragraph\"><strong>Nik Lysytskiy:<\/strong>  Was it your own idea?<\/p>\n\n\n\n<p class=\"wp-block-paragraph\"><strong>Petro Maha:<\/strong> Yes, I wanted to do everything \u2014 to draw, play football, box, play basketball, join the agit-brigade. By the time I joined the agit-theater, I was about fourteen.<\/p>\n\n\n\n<p class=\"wp-block-paragraph\">The head of the jury back then was old Mikhalkov \u2014 the one who rewrote the Soviet anthem. He was already quite elderly, a tall, imposing man. He handed us our diplomas in Lviv \u2014 they had to feed him and give him water, he was that frail. He looked at me and said, \u201cYoung man, are you going to do this seriously?\u201d I said, \u201cYes, I want to be a detective.\u201d What a fool I was. But those words \u2014 \u201care you going to do it?\u201d \u2014 stuck in my head.<\/p>\n\n\n\n<p class=\"wp-block-paragraph\">From that moment, I started thinking seriously about theater. But to be honest, we didn\u2019t have much of a Ukrainian identity there. I studied in a Russian school in Chop. People can say what they want, but yes \u2014 they stifled us there.<\/p>\n\n\n\n<p class=\"wp-block-paragraph\">The school was Russian, the teachers were good, but the purpose was to make us like the children of KGB officers, border guards, and railway troops stationed in Chop. That was the environment.<\/p>\n\n\n\n<p class=\"wp-block-paragraph\">So my Transcarpathian identity really existed only on two holidays \u2014 Christmas and Easter.<\/p>\n\n\n\n<p class=\"wp-block-paragraph\"><strong>Nik Lysytskiy:<\/strong>  The two main ones.<\/p>\n\n\n\n<p class=\"wp-block-paragraph\"><strong>Petro Maha:<\/strong> Exactly. At Easter, there was no church in the village. People would gather in someone\u2019s yard, bring a priest. I remember the cold, the darkness, the prayers, candles glowing over the baskets, cold water splashed on your face \u2014 and the words, \u201cChrist is risen!\u201d And you\u2019re happy.<\/p>\n\n\n\n<p class=\"wp-block-paragraph\">And Christmas \u2014 that was all about caroling. Our Transcarpathian carols were very different from what I later heard in central Ukraine. In the center, it was \u201cChrist is born, God is incarnate, angels sing, kings are greeted\u201d \u2014 all on one note. But in the Transcarpathian version, \u201cChrist is born, God is incarnate, angels sing, kings are greeted\u201d \u2014 it was broader, fuller, deeper.<\/p>\n\n\n\n<p class=\"wp-block-paragraph\">I later spoke with some musicians about it, and they said, yes, there are regional variations \u2014 and they\u2019re fascinating. Take, for example, Andrii Khlyvniuk, who introduced the whole world to the song \u201cOh, the Red Viburnum in the Meadow.<\/p>\n\n\n\n<p class=\"wp-block-paragraph\">It\u2019s wonderful \u2014 the world sang <em>kalyna<\/em> (viburnum) \u2014 but to the wrong melody. In its classical version, the one written by composers, the melody is much richer, more colorful. Khlyvniuk made it more forceful, almost fatalistic \u2014 and that\u2019s not a bad thing, because he brought it to the world\u2019s attention.<\/p>\n\n\n\n<p class=\"wp-block-paragraph\">We need to do the same with our ancient identity \u2014 make it engaging for children. When you tell kids that the yin-yang symbol appeared in Trypillian culture long before China \u2014 they go, \u201cWow!\u201d When you tell them that Taras Hryhorovych Shevchenko\u2019s paintings are now studied in the Flemish school of art alongside Rembrandt\u2019s \u2014 again, \u201cWow!\u201d<\/p>\n\n\n\n<p class=\"wp-block-paragraph\">And Taras Hryhorovych \u2014 despite his tragic fate as a serf \u2014 wore a watch bracelet, had his own quirks, passions, and women.<\/p>\n\n\n\n<p class=\"wp-block-paragraph\"><strong>Nik Lysytskiy:<\/strong>  A rock star?<\/p>\n\n\n\n<p class=\"wp-block-paragraph\"><strong>Petro Maha:<\/strong> Exactly \u2014 literally a rock star. And why not? Why shouldn\u2019t we see him that way?<\/p>\n\n\n\n<p class=\"wp-block-paragraph\">You see, someone once decided for us how to erase our self-identity \u2014 to portray us only through misery and suffering. The endless poverty of serfdom, Haritya\u2019s mother dying of tuberculosis, wandering the village begging so she doesn\u2019t starve. Everything dark, everything hopeless.<\/p>\n\n\n\n<p class=\"wp-block-paragraph\">But read the works of European scholars who studied Ukraine \u2014 many of them compared us to the Netherlands. The mentality is similar: the need for beauty, cleanliness, order. Every yard should be tidy, with flowers, the walls whitewashed, the home spotless.<\/p>\n\n\n\n<p class=\"wp-block-paragraph\">I once visited a house in Vorokhta, in the Hutsul region \u2014 it felt like someone had poured sunlight around it. Everything fresh, embroidered, white, perfectly clean \u2014 not a speck of dust, as if no one dared disturb the space. Where does this come from in our people?<\/p>\n\n\n\n<p class=\"wp-block-paragraph\">Ukrainians absorb other cultures just as we absorbed foreign words when our language was forming. But still, we remain distinct.<\/p>\n\n\n\n<p class=\"wp-block-paragraph\">My grandfather, for instance, spoke English. He had formed as a person in America. And when he was arrested for \u201canti-Soviet propaganda,\u201d let me tell you why \u2014 it shocked me recently when I read an article about it.<\/p>\n\n\n\n<p class=\"wp-block-paragraph\">He was imprisoned for singing a <em>chastivka<\/em> (a short humorous folk verse). In Russian. But he didn\u2019t even know Russian! He once asked my grandmother what the word \u201cpusyarus\u201d meant. She said, \u201cThere\u2019s no such word.\u201d He said, \u201cHow can that be? The Muscovites sing, \u2018Pusyarus, noble!\u2019\u201d That was the extent of his Russian.<\/p>\n\n\n\n<p class=\"wp-block-paragraph\">So, he sang a <em>chastivka<\/em> \u2014 and they gave him ten years for it.<\/p>\n\n\n\n<p class=\"wp-block-paragraph\">And just the other night, I read an article about Korney Chukovsky. Since childhood, we were read his, let\u2019s say, slightly delirious poems. The system didn\u2019t like him much \u2014 especially Nadezhda Konstantinovna Krupskaya. She once called a special meeting to declare that a mosquito cannot marry a fly because they\u2019re different species! The fact that this mosquito flew, swung a saber, and chopped off a spider\u2019s head didn\u2019t bother her at all.<\/p>\n\n\n\n<p class=\"wp-block-paragraph\">But Chukovsky sometimes wrote truly bold things. After World War II ended, he wrote a very harsh poem about widows \u2014 about how there were no men left, how women had no one to live with or have children with, and what would become of the future.<\/p>\n\n\n\n<p class=\"wp-block-paragraph\">And the final lines went like this:<br>\u201cThere are many girls, many girls,<br>And the girls have nowhere to go.\u201d<\/p>\n\n\n\n<p class=\"wp-block-paragraph\">\u201cIf the horses rest, we\u2019ll plow like girls.\u201d That\u2019s the verse my grandfather sang as a <em>chastivka<\/em> (folk ditty). The original poem had been published in <em>Pravda<\/em>, but after his performance, it was declared anti-Soviet propaganda because someone denounced him.<\/p>\n\n\n\n<p class=\"wp-block-paragraph\">Today, you could just go online, hire a lawyer fresh out of law school, and they\u2019d tear that accusation apart in two seconds. But back then, there was no way to fight it \u2014 once they decided you, me, or even our cameraman were \u201cenemies of the people,\u201d that was it.<\/p>\n\n\n\n<p class=\"wp-block-paragraph\">Forgive me for jumping between topics, but our national self-identity was deeply scarred by the Holodomor, by arrests, and yet \u2014 paradoxically \u2014 it also broadened the range of our creative expression. How many songs were written about the famine? How many about the road to Siberia?<\/p>\n\n\n\n<p class=\"wp-block-paragraph\"><strong>Nik Lysytskiy:<\/strong>  And that, too, was a form of self-expression?<\/p>\n\n\n\n<p class=\"wp-block-paragraph\"><strong>Petro Maha:<\/strong> Absolutely. For example, the song that Sviatoslav Vakarchuk performed so beautifully \u2014 \u201cOceans of Glory\u201d from <em>Halytskyi Krai<\/em> \u2014 my grandmother used to sing it to me. It was about people leaving.<\/p>\n\n\n\n<p class=\"wp-block-paragraph\">My grandfather told me that to get to New York, all the ships heading there would sail the same route as the Titanic. He had to take a sea shuttle from Antwerp. That didn\u2019t surprise me, because his brother had sailed on the <em>Carpathia<\/em> \u2014 the ship that rescued people from the Titanic \u2014 and my grandfather sailed on the <em>Lapland<\/em>.<\/p>\n\n\n\n<p class=\"wp-block-paragraph\">All the documents are still preserved. You can look them up \u2014 it says there: \u201cIlia Maha.\u201d Two passengers \u2014 one 51 years old, one 19. The 19-year-old was my grandfather. It even says which class he sailed in from Antwerp.<\/p>\n\n\n\n<p class=\"wp-block-paragraph\">And when I think about how they traveled from the tiny village of Rakovo, in the Perechyn district of Zakarpattia, all the way to Antwerp \u2014 it gives me goosebumps. How much we don\u2019t know about ourselves, about our own history, about what they went through and how they preserved it.<\/p>\n\n\n\n<p class=\"wp-block-paragraph\">Only now are we starting to rediscover such stories \u2014 like when, during a Soviet Union vs. GDR match in Canada, a Ukrainian man, who passed away just a week ago, ran onto the field with a Ukrainian flag and danced the <em>hopak<\/em>. What a blow that was to both the GDR and the USSR!<\/p>\n\n\n\n<p class=\"wp-block-paragraph\">And how many hockey players came out of Ukrainian leagues? It\u2019s incredible. For example, Mike Krushelnyski \u2014 a star of the Toronto Maple Leafs \u2014 even had a clause in his contract saying he wouldn\u2019t train on Sundays, because he took his children to Ukrainian Sunday school. And sadly, even that tradition is fading now.<\/p>\n\n\n\n<p class=\"wp-block-paragraph\">There\u2019s still so much in the diaspora \u2014 but the children there often no longer speak Ukrainian.<\/p>\n\n\n\n<p class=\"wp-block-paragraph\"><strong>Nik Lysytskiy:<\/strong>  Actually, that reminds me of the <em>hopak<\/em> at the stadium. And we began with the idea that self-expression isn\u2019t just about songs or dances \u2014 it\u2019s much broader. Which brings up an interesting question: what <em>is<\/em> self-expression? Is it art? Is it a profession? A way to say something? A way to be heard? What is it really?<\/p>\n\n\n\n<p class=\"wp-block-paragraph\"><strong>Petro Maha:<\/strong> For me, it\u2019s the richness of a person\u2019s inner world. If a child in front of me is crying, I can pick up three stones and start juggling. Or grab a twig, spin it, balance it \u2014 do something playful. Because I know how to juggle, and I understand a bit about performance.<\/p>\n\n\n\n<p class=\"wp-block-paragraph\">If I need to keep a group of people together, I can do it for days \u2014 by singing, telling stories, or weaving in bits of theater, literature, anything that keeps them engaged. I\u2019ll find what sparks their interest.<\/p>\n\n\n\n<p class=\"wp-block-paragraph\"><strong>Nik Lysytskiy:<\/strong>  Did you learn that somewhere, or does it just come naturally?<\/p>\n\n\n\n<p class=\"wp-block-paragraph\"><strong>Petro Maha:<\/strong> You know, if a person doesn\u2019t open themselves to the world, they\u2019ll always struggle. Of course, people have different personalities, different temperaments \u2014 but I\u2019ve always had something to share.<\/p>\n\n\n\n<p class=\"wp-block-paragraph\">Sometimes I\u2019ll just sit down and draw \u2014 that\u2019s one form of self-expression. Or I\u2019ll sing \u2014 I know many songs, and that\u2019s another way. My grandmother, may she rest in peace, used to tell me Transcarpathian fairy tales with her hands \u2014 full of gestures and emotion \u2014 and she never once repeated herself.<\/p>\n\n\n\n<p class=\"wp-block-paragraph\">Wow! Thank God someone recorded all of this. There were quite a few \u2014 just imagine: <em>Wooden Miracle<\/em>, <em>Tales of Verkhovyna<\/em>, <em>Kymak<\/em>, <em>Child<\/em>, <em>Tales of One Village<\/em>. I don\u2019t even remember them all. That\u2019s actually a list of Transcarpathian folk tales recorded in just one village \u2014 Horynchevo.<\/p>\n\n\n\n<p class=\"wp-block-paragraph\">Thank God there was someone there who cared enough to preserve it. Because what if there hadn\u2019t been?<\/p>\n\n\n\n<p class=\"wp-block-paragraph\"><strong>Nik Lysytskiy:<\/strong>  There used to be one in every village, right? Almost every village had its own storyteller.<\/p>\n\n\n\n<p class=\"wp-block-paragraph\"><strong>Petro Maha:<\/strong> Yes, some kind of storyteller. In my village, there was a woman who kept the history of the whole community. Or take a simple woodcarver \u2014 someone who just spends his life cutting wood. Every movement he makes fascinates me, because in that moment, he\u2019s not only expressing himself \u2014 he\u2019s carrying behind him an entire layer of everything he\u2019s absorbed.<\/p>\n\n\n\n<p class=\"wp-block-paragraph\">Self-expression is a small concentration of something vast that fills a person. Faina Georgiivna Ranevskaya once said that people are very different among us: some have fairy tales, theater, and songs inside them \u2014 and others have only worms.<\/p>\n\n\n\n<p class=\"wp-block-paragraph\">A person can express themselves through one little pattern scratched on a cup \u2014 and you look at it and think, \u201cWow.\u201d And yet all this pop junk that\u2019s appeared lately \u2014 it\u2019s built on imitation. You go to a souvenir market somewhere, even at Niagara Falls, and every trinket has a \u201cMade in China\u201d label. Everything\u2019s mass-produced.<\/p>\n\n\n\n<p class=\"wp-block-paragraph\">And it\u2019s reached us too. Embroidered shirts are machine-stitched in China and sold here. Wooden spoons and carvings are cut out by automated machines. It\u2019s not life anymore, you know? That\u2019s why we have to protect every real craftsman we still have.<\/p>\n\n\n\n<p class=\"wp-block-paragraph\">There used to be folklore expeditions \u2014 people went to villages, recorded on tape recorders with terrible sound quality, but still captured songs that might have otherwise vanished.<\/p>\n\n\n\n<p class=\"wp-block-paragraph\"><strong>Nik Lysytskiy:<\/strong>  They\u2019re still recording today, too.<\/p>\n\n\n\n<p class=\"wp-block-paragraph\"><strong>Petro Maha:<\/strong> They are, but people are leaving us. You know, in the past, what did grandmothers do in the evenings? They sat on benches and sang. And they weren\u2019t all from the same village \u2014 there would be five old women from one place, and another who had married in from somewhere else. She\u2019d share the songs her mother taught her \u2014 and so it went, passed on and on.<\/p>\n\n\n\n<p class=\"wp-block-paragraph\">And now? They sit and watch Mexican, Brazilian, Turkish, or \u2014 God forbid \u2014 South Korean dramas. And then they spend the evening discussing whether Esterci will ever find the child she forgot twelve episodes ago because of memory loss. That\u2019s what it\u2019s come to.<\/p>\n\n\n\n<p class=\"wp-block-paragraph\">The space around us is being filled with this TikTok-style format. And I\u2019m afraid it\u2019s making the world flat and uninteresting. Our children have started to look fiercely alike \u2014 whether American, German, Chinese, Russian, or Indonesian \u2014 they\u2019re all living in the same virtual reality.<\/p>\n\n\n\n<p class=\"wp-block-paragraph\">In that world, if you want a Rolex, it gives you twenty to choose from. You want a Rolls-Royce \u2014 and through virtual reality, you\u2019re already \u201cdriving\u201d it. For a few minutes, you feel something. But then reality hits, and you realize it\u2019s all hollow.<\/p>\n\n\n\n<p class=\"wp-block-paragraph\">For me, it\u2019s like when I first imagined Alaska \u2014 and then saw it on TV. It was completely different.<\/p>\n\n\n\n<p class=\"wp-block-paragraph\"><strong>Nik Lysytskiy:<\/strong>  I\u2019d like to remind our viewers that today, in the \u201cArchetype of the Nation\u201d studio, we\u2019re talking about self-expression and creativity with Petro Maha.<\/p>\n\n\n\n<p class=\"wp-block-paragraph\">You\u2019ve actually touched on a topic I planned to bring up later \u2014 but since we\u2019re already there, let\u2019s talk about it. I mean the traditions and ways of self-expression that once existed when every village had its own storyteller \u2014 a person who told tales that were never repeated, because the beauty of folklore lies in the fact that everyone adds something of their own.<\/p>\n\n\n\n<p class=\"wp-block-paragraph\">The same goes for songs. On one hand, we now have unlimited content online. But perhaps that\u2019s exactly why there are no more storytellers or song-makers among the younger generation \u2014 because all the tales and songs already exist online; you can just listen or read them.<\/p>\n\n\n\n<p class=\"wp-block-paragraph\">On the other hand, new forms of self-expression are emerging \u2014 blogs, reels, memes, and so on. Is this evolution or degradation?<\/p>\n\n\n\n<p class=\"wp-block-paragraph\"><strong>Petro Maha:<\/strong> It\u2019s degradation.<\/p>\n\n\n\n<p class=\"wp-block-paragraph\">And I\u2019ll tell you why I think so. It completely kills people\u2019s ability for critical thinking. As someone with, let\u2019s say, an IQ slightly higher than that of a canary, I\u2019m not interested in watching people who think exactly like me.<\/p>\n\n\n\n<p class=\"wp-block-paragraph\">I prefer to listen to three or four different opinions and then try to find the truth somewhere in between. But look what\u2019s happening now \u2014 everyone suddenly thinks they\u2019re an expert. The worst are the so-called \u201coffice plankton.\u201d<\/p>\n\n\n\n<p class=\"wp-block-paragraph\">May God forgive me for singling out that group, but these are people who once wanted to achieve something, yet didn\u2019t. And now they sit and criticize everything \u2014 calling others idiots, fools, morons \u2014 claiming they would do it all better themselves.<\/p>\n\n\n\n<p class=\"wp-block-paragraph\">Tell me honestly \u2014 do you write comments online? I don\u2019t. I have neither the time nor the desire. And when I read some of those conspiracy theories, wild assumptions, and endless nonsense, it honestly frightens me.<\/p>\n\n\n\n<p class=\"wp-block-paragraph\"><strong>Nik Lysytskiy:<\/strong>  Let\u2019s try to shift our conversation to something more positive. Because it might sound like we\u2019re saying everything used to be better \u2014 traditional, proper \u2014 and now technology has ruined it. But maybe what\u2019s really happening is that technology affects us so deeply that it\u2019s no longer about self-expression, but about a need to be heard.<\/p>\n\n\n\n<p class=\"wp-block-paragraph\"><strong>Petro Maha:<\/strong> You can look at it from many angles. Take Anton Pavlovych Chekhov\u2019s <em>The Cherry Orchard.<\/em> There are the old women who refuse to cut down the trees because they bloom beautifully, and then Lopakhin arrives \u2014 he wants to cut down the orchard because a railway is going to pass through. So who\u2019s right?<\/p>\n\n\n\n<p class=\"wp-block-paragraph\">The old ones who want to preserve the garden, even though it no longer bears fruit \u2014 or the man who wants to build the railway and move forward? If you look at it that way, you\u2019d say, of course, Lopakhin\u2019s right \u2014 he\u2019s the man of progress. But what if he\u2019s just a profiteer, wanting to make a quick ruble, while for the others, that orchard is their whole life?<\/p>\n\n\n\n<p class=\"wp-block-paragraph\">You see, everything depends on perspective.<\/p>\n\n\n\n<p class=\"wp-block-paragraph\">And how could I, for example, reject the achievements of civilization? Right now, I\u2019m speaking into an American microphone \u2014 or maybe a Chinese one. Designed by Americans, made in China. I arrived here in a Japanese car. I use an American phone \u2014 again, made in China.<\/p>\n\n\n\n<p class=\"wp-block-paragraph\">If I wanted to see the entire world, I wouldn\u2019t have enough lifetime to do it. So, of course, you can\u2019t just dismiss it all. But at the same time, we must preserve what is truly ours.<\/p>\n\n\n\n<p class=\"wp-block-paragraph\">What scares me most isn\u2019t urbanization \u2014 it\u2019s globalization. Because part of globalization is depopularization, denationalization. There are things people identify with very deeply.<\/p>\n\n\n\n<p class=\"wp-block-paragraph\">Take the Latvian flag, for example. Do you know what that shade of red is called? It\u2019s \u201cLatvian red.\u201d It\u2019s not exactly red, and not brown either \u2014 it\u2019s something unique, distinct.<\/p>\n\n\n\n<p class=\"wp-block-paragraph\">Or think of embroidery \u2014 have you heard of the \u201cBulgarian cross-stitch\u201d? Why is it called that? Because that\u2019s how the Bulgarians embroidered \u2014 with their own technique.<\/p>\n\n\n\n<p class=\"wp-block-paragraph\">In Ukraine, people have always named things with meaning. We\u2019ve enriched the world in countless ways. I once watched Dmytro Komarov\u2019s show, where he visited the Amish in America. Do you know what they call a <em>chesnyk<\/em> (garlic press)? A <em>chesnyk<\/em>! Not <em>havlik<\/em>, as in German, but <em>chesnyk.<\/em> Because Ukrainian immigrants taught them to use it \u2014 and the name stuck.<\/p>\n\n\n\n<p class=\"wp-block-paragraph\">The Hungarians, who were once nomadic tribes, borrowed almost all the names of agricultural tools from Ukrainians. They had no native words for \u201cshovel\u201d or \u201cpitchfork\u201d \u2014 those came from us.<\/p>\n\n\n\n<p class=\"wp-block-paragraph\">All of this was built over centuries. It\u2019s a whole wealth of culture and knowledge \u2014 and that, too, is self-expression.<\/p>\n\n\n\n<p class=\"wp-block-paragraph\">Listen, any ceremony in Ukraine \u2014 whatever you take \u2014 is unlike any other. And even across regions, they differ completely. In Transcarpathia, for example, at funerals, there used to be <em>mummers<\/em> \u2014 people dressed up in costumes who walked around making others laugh, to help ease the pain of death. Have you ever heard of that? And in Transcarpathia, they would take the deceased to the cemetery on a sleigh \u2014 even in summer.<\/p>\n\n\n\n<p class=\"wp-block-paragraph\"><strong>Nik Lysytskiy:<\/strong>  Not only in Transcarpathia, by the way. Yes.<\/p>\n\n\n\n<p class=\"wp-block-paragraph\"><strong>Petro Maha:<\/strong> Exactly. That\u2019s why I\u2019m all for preserving everything unique in every corner of Ukraine \u2014 every Hutsul word, every Lemko word, every Boyko word. Of course, we must all know the Ukrainian language and be united as one nation. But at the same time \u2014 allow me to give an example I\u2019ve used before \u2014 take the American national tennis team of that era: Pete Sampras was Greek, Jim Courier was Belgian, Michael Chang was Chinese, and Ivan Lendl was Czech. Yet they were all part of the <em>American<\/em> team.<\/p>\n\n\n\n<p class=\"wp-block-paragraph\"><strong>Nik Lysytskiy:<\/strong>  Because they gather the best. Of course.<\/p>\n\n\n\n<p class=\"wp-block-paragraph\"><strong>Petro Maha:<\/strong> Exactly \u2014 \u201cI am American.\u201d That\u2019s what unites them. And then someone like Andy Warhol comes along \u2014 people, listen! Ukrainians should be proud not only of being recognized by others, but of those whose roots come from here. For example, the house of Tusin Hoga in Sadagura, near Chernivtsi \u2014 that\u2019s where <em>Hava Nagila<\/em> was written. Calvin Klein \u2014 born to Jewish parents from Bukovyna.<\/p>\n\n\n\n<p class=\"wp-block-paragraph\">And look at others: Dustin Hoffman, David Duchovny \u2014<\/p>\n\n\n\n<p class=\"wp-block-paragraph\"><strong>Nik Lysytskiy:<\/strong>  Sylvester Stallone, I think.<\/p>\n\n\n\n<p class=\"wp-block-paragraph\"><strong>Petro Maha:<\/strong> Yes, Sylvester Stallone, Leonardo DiCaprio, Steven Spielberg, Mila Kunis, Milla Jovovich, Volodymyr Palahniuk (that\u2019s Jack Palance), Sean Penn \u2014 all with Ukrainian roots.<\/p>\n\n\n\n<p class=\"wp-block-paragraph\">To me, the greatest value of Andy Warhol isn\u2019t just that he was the father of pop art \u2014 but that, in his later years, he returned to his Rusyn roots. He died within the Greek Catholic community and was buried in a Greek Catholic cemetery. He spent his final years atoning for his sins \u2014 and he had plenty, of course.<\/p>\n\n\n\n<p class=\"wp-block-paragraph\">That\u2019s why I say there\u2019s something wrong with this so-called \u201cprogress,\u201d when people now spend 9 or 10 hours a day in front of a screen. Imagine if they devoted even half that time to learning something meaningful. They\u2019d know who Andy Warhol was.<\/p>\n\n\n\n<p class=\"wp-block-paragraph\">You know, I had a funny experience recently. I teach at the Institute of Film and Television. During exams, there was a guest \u2014 Mr. Budko, the general producer of the Tony Awards. At one point, he said, \u201cThat was great \u2014 he even reminded me a bit of Charles Aznavour.\u201d And I looked at the students \u2014 blank faces. Nothing.<\/p>\n\n\n\n<p class=\"wp-block-paragraph\">I said, \u201cCome on, guys.\u201d Some of them were studying sports journalism \u2014 they live and breathe football. So I tried to connect it. I said, \u201cSasha, tell me, who comes to mind among French footballers of Armenian origin?\u201d He replied, \u201cAlain Boghossian, Youri Djorkaeff.\u201d \u201cGood,\u201d I said. \u201cAnd who is Charles Aznavour?\u201d Silence.<\/p>\n\n\n\n<p class=\"wp-block-paragraph\">They didn\u2019t know. I explained, \u201cCharles Aznavour is the greatest <em>chansonnier<\/em> \u2014 the most famous Armenian artist of all time.\u201d And then I added, \u201cNowadays they say Kim Kardashian surpassed him \u2014 but let\u2019s not discuss <em>how<\/em> she surpassed him.\u201d<\/p>\n\n\n\n<p class=\"wp-block-paragraph\">And then I thought, I could tell them that Aznavour was Edith Piaf\u2019s husband \u2014 but I realized I\u2019d first have to explain who Edith Piaf was. And again \u2014 the same blank faces.<\/p>\n\n\n\n<p class=\"wp-block-paragraph\">Do you see? That\u2019s what worries me most about our people right now.<\/p>\n\n\n\n<p class=\"wp-block-paragraph\">And they\u2019re becoming Americans in that same sense \u2014 the way Americans often believe that history began only when Comrade Columbus arrived on their shores. As if before that, nothing in the world existed at all. You see what I mean?<\/p>\n\n\n\n<p class=\"wp-block-paragraph\">And here, in our country, people have started to believe that nothing existed before independence.<\/p>\n\n\n\n<p class=\"wp-block-paragraph\"><strong>Nik Lysytskiy:<\/strong>  Are these people mostly those born after independence?<\/p>\n\n\n\n<p class=\"wp-block-paragraph\"><strong>Petro Maha:<\/strong> Exactly. And maybe they\u2019re just not interested. I\u2019m not upset that they can\u2019t name the fifteen Soviet republics \u2014 that\u2019s not the point. But when I see fools online asking whether Alaska is a country or a republic, or claiming that its capital is Venice \u2014 well, that\u2019s just\u2026 wonderful.<\/p>\n\n\n\n<p class=\"wp-block-paragraph\">Still, a lot has been lost. Of course, humanity has created incredible things like Wikipedia \u2014 at least you can go and look things up there. I just hope that after watching our conversation, someone will go on Wikipedia and check who that \u201cannoying guy in glasses\u201d is \u2014 meaning me.<\/p>\n\n\n\n<p class=\"wp-block-paragraph\"><strong>Nik Lysytskiy:<\/strong>  And be sure to leave a nice comment.<\/p>\n\n\n\n<p class=\"wp-block-paragraph\"><strong>Petro Maha:<\/strong> Oh, yes. I\u2019m already predicting it.<\/p>\n\n\n\n<p class=\"wp-block-paragraph\"><strong>Nik Lysytskiy:<\/strong>  And share their impressions \u2014 express their opinion about self-expression.<\/p>\n\n\n\n<p class=\"wp-block-paragraph\"><strong>Petro Maha:<\/strong> Yes, exactly. You know what\u2019s the paradox? The people who will truly like what we\u2019re saying \u2014 they won\u2019t write anything. They\u2019ll just be quietly happy for us.<\/p>\n\n\n\n<p class=\"wp-block-paragraph\">But those who have that built-in reflex to type \u2014 they\u2019ll jump straight into the comments. They\u2019ll go through all the channels, all the posts. And the sad truth is that people with real critical thinking are becoming fewer and fewer. That\u2019s the problem.<\/p>\n\n\n\n<p class=\"wp-block-paragraph\">I\u2019m afraid we\u2019re letting the worst parts of our current mentality seep into our national identity \u2014 things like envy, na\u00efvet\u00e9, gullibility. And now, with artificial intelligence, it\u2019s getting truly frightening. They can completely change what you said.<\/p>\n\n\n\n<p class=\"wp-block-paragraph\">We could be sitting here right now, and someone could generate a lecture from this video \u2014 on artificial insemination of house finches \u2014 and it would look real. The image on screen stops being proof of anything. Because everything can now be recreated, regenerated.<\/p>\n\n\n\n<p class=\"wp-block-paragraph\">I don\u2019t know how we\u2019ll deal with that. But one thing will never change \u2014 what\u2019s written in myths and fairy tales. Those truths stay the same.<\/p>\n\n\n\n<p class=\"wp-block-paragraph\">And it\u2019s not by accident that in our fairy tales, Ivan is clever and resourceful \u2014 while in Russian tales, Ivan is \u201cthe Fool.\u201d That\u2019s a huge difference. The Russian Ivan dreams of catching a magic pike that will grant him everything \u2014 a house, firewood, comfort \u2014 without lifting a finger.<\/p>\n\n\n\n<p class=\"wp-block-paragraph\">But our Ukrainian Ivan works. He toils, he struggles, he builds. That\u2019s our difference.<\/p>\n\n\n\n<p class=\"wp-block-paragraph\">There\u2019s even that old tale \u2014 \u201cPlay, Sopilka, Play.\u201d It tells of two brothers, where one kills the other \u2014 over a wild boar, just because one succeeded in the hunt and the other didn\u2019t.<\/p>\n\n\n\n<p class=\"wp-block-paragraph\">That\u2019s what I sometimes want to ask our people: why? Why did you do that? Why didn\u2019t you show up when it mattered? Every nation has its dark sides, and in ours, there\u2019s a tendency not to admit them.<\/p>\n\n\n\n<p class=\"wp-block-paragraph\">The Germans, for example, found the strength to repent \u2014 to say, \u201cYes, we were wrong. We were cruel.\u201d But we often keep insisting, \u201cWell, yes, but we\u2019re good.\u201d A Ukrainian person doesn\u2019t like to admit when they\u2019re wrong. Really doesn\u2019t.<\/p>\n\n\n\n<p class=\"wp-block-paragraph\"><strong>Nik Lysytskiy:<\/strong>  We\u2019re exploring the fundamental values that define the Ukrainian people \u2014 and today, even though we\u2019re talking about self-expression, we\u2019ve touched on many others as well. But since we\u2019re on this topic \u2014 you\u2019ve mentioned that you teach at the University of Culture, and that you also mentor young actors at the Theater of Personality.<\/p>\n\n\n\n<p class=\"wp-block-paragraph\"><strong>Petro Maha:<\/strong> Yes, I perform on the same stage with them \u2014 and it\u2019s wonderful.<\/p>\n\n\n\n<p class=\"wp-block-paragraph\"><strong>Nik Lysytskiy:<\/strong>  So, if we talk about these young people \u2014 your students, those you work with directly \u2014 how do they express themselves? Do they actively seek self-expression? And if we compare you at their age to them today, what differences do you see?<\/p>\n\n\n\n<p class=\"wp-block-paragraph\"><strong>Petro Maha:<\/strong> And you know, nothing has really changed. First, let me clarify \u2014 I don\u2019t want to sound like some grumpy old man. There has always been a conflict between generations. I honestly believe that every new generation is, in many ways, better than the one before it.<\/p>\n\n\n\n<p class=\"wp-block-paragraph\">There\u2019s that famous line from the classics: \u201cOur generation is the last on this planet; the next one is terrible \u2014 we\u2019re all doomed.\u201d Socrates said that. Thousands of years have passed, and yet people still say the same thing.<\/p>\n\n\n\n<p class=\"wp-block-paragraph\">And then there\u2019s Churchill\u2019s quote: \u201cIf you were not a revolutionary in your youth, you have no heart; if you\u2019re not a conservative in your old age, you have no brain.\u201d<\/p>\n\n\n\n<p class=\"wp-block-paragraph\">So when I look at today\u2019s youth \u2014 the colorful hair, the piercings, the tattoos everywhere \u2014 I don\u2019t judge them. But sometimes, I see that all this self-expression hides a kind of inner insecurity.<\/p>\n\n\n\n<p class=\"wp-block-paragraph\">I remember once I almost got beaten up by some of the old Dynamo Kyiv players. I came to a dinner \u2014 Oleg Kuznetsov was there, Anatolii Demianenko, Mykhailichenko, real legends. I looked at them and said, \u201cHow did you guys even play football? You look like amateurs.\u201d<\/p>\n\n\n\n<p class=\"wp-block-paragraph\">They glared at me, ready to explode. I added, \u201cYou don\u2019t even have tattoos! Real footballers nowadays are covered head to toe!\u201d They laughed, but I meant it as a point \u2014 now the young generation of players, who keep losing to everyone, don\u2019t have a free inch of skin left.<\/p>\n\n\n\n<p class=\"wp-block-paragraph\">What I\u2019m saying is \u2014 self-expression shouldn\u2019t replace professionalism. Tattoos, piercings, fashion \u2014 fine. But whatever you do \u2014 be great at it. If you\u2019re a brilliant coder, a strong vocalist, a talented cameraman, or even a good taxi driver \u2014 do it better than anyone else.<\/p>\n\n\n\n<p class=\"wp-block-paragraph\">Our streets are dirty not because there\u2019s no one to clean them, but because people don\u2019t do their jobs professionally. If I were cleaning toilets, they\u2019d be the cleanest toilets in the world. I can\u2019t do things halfway. That\u2019s what everyone needs \u2014 the desire to do your job <em>well.<\/em><\/p>\n\n\n\n<p class=\"wp-block-paragraph\"><strong>Nik Lysytskiy:<\/strong>  How do you see the connection between self-expression, creativity, and freedom? In your youth, there were strict limitations \u2014 censorship, forbidden topics. Now, you can say or wear whatever you want.<\/p>\n\n\n\n<p class=\"wp-block-paragraph\"><strong>Petro Maha:<\/strong> Makarevich has a great song about that \u2014 I don\u2019t want to sound like a Muscovite, but it\u2019s about how you finally break through, you\u2019re free to move forward \u2014 but you stop, and you don\u2019t know where to go next.<\/p>\n\n\n\n<p class=\"wp-block-paragraph\">Because back then, when you were fighting the system, there was a goal. There were dissident poets, writers, who produced incredibly powerful work.<\/p>\n\n\n\n<p class=\"wp-block-paragraph\">But look what happened after \u2014 as soon as the era of jokes about shortages and Soviet absurdity ended, Mikhail Zhvanetsky \u2014 our brilliant compatriot \u2014 said, \u201cWe might not have everything, we might lack a lot, but we had humor.\u201d And when that ended, all the humor slid down to the lower parts of the body. Every level of culture became obsessed with vulgarity. It\u2019s terrible.<\/p>\n\n\n\n<p class=\"wp-block-paragraph\"><strong>Nik Lysytskiy:<\/strong>  How did it happen that our folklore \u2014 which for centuries was created under oppression and always carried a spark of protest, of resistance \u2014 changed direction so drastically? During the Soviet period, we had authors and dissidents expressing their defiance through art. And yet, when freedom came, self-expression sometimes turned into self-deprecation.<\/p>\n\n\n\n<p class=\"wp-block-paragraph\"><strong>Petro Maha:<\/strong> Because we were conditioned that way. For decades, people were taught to suppress themselves. Anyone who came from a small village \u2014 say, from Velyki Zaperedylivtsi \u2014 to Kyiv would immediately switch to speaking Russian. It became automatic.<\/p>\n\n\n\n<p class=\"wp-block-paragraph\">It was ingrained in us. Take Iryna Bilyk, for example \u2014 she started singing in Ukrainian, then switched to Russian. I actually spoke with her about it once. She told me, \u201cIt\u2019s awful. When I released a Ukrainian-language album, audiences started shrinking. Then I made a Russian one \u2014 and the stadiums were packed.\u201d<\/p>\n\n\n\n<p class=\"wp-block-paragraph\">Or take Vitya Pavlik \u2014 after his Ukrainian hits like \u201cGreen City Holiday,\u201d he switched too. Why? Because that\u2019s what the system rewarded. That\u2019s what filled the concert halls.<\/p>\n\n\n\n<p class=\"wp-block-paragraph\">And that\u2019s the tragedy \u2014 that people were made to feel they couldn\u2019t succeed while being truly themselves.<\/p>\n\n\n\n<p class=\"wp-block-paragraph\">That\u2019s exactly it \u2014 our inferiority complex. We still think that if we speak like the Muscovites, we sound cooler, smarter, more \u201ccivilized.\u201d<\/p>\n\n\n\n<p class=\"wp-block-paragraph\"><strong>Nik Lysytskiy:<\/strong>  Do you think that\u2019s changed much now?<\/p>\n\n\n\n<p class=\"wp-block-paragraph\"><strong>Petro Maha:<\/strong> Not really. Horror! The kids today are listening to Russian rap full of profanity. Why? Because the forbidden fruit is always the sweetest.<\/p>\n\n\n\n<p class=\"wp-block-paragraph\">My own daughter went through it. In school, she refused to speak Russian \u2014 and for that, they hated her. She tells me stories now that make my blood boil. If I had known then what was happening, I swear, even though she was just a child, I would\u2019ve come and punched someone.<\/p>\n\n\n\n<p class=\"wp-block-paragraph\">They forced her into Russian classes, into that environment, because everyone was listening to it. And now they\u2019ve switched to these so-called \u201cshamans,\u201d \u201cdemons\u201d \u2014 whatever new idols appear online. And it\u2019s scary how easily they get to young people, especially teenagers, just by slipping into the things they like.<\/p>\n\n\n\n<p class=\"wp-block-paragraph\">That\u2019s why I think the biggest problem in this country still begins in kindergarten. Every year, it only gets worse. Until we put kindergarten teachers and schoolteachers on a pedestal, nothing good will change.<\/p>\n\n\n\n<p class=\"wp-block-paragraph\">These are the sad thoughts I sometimes have. I dream of a country of intelligent people. A country where people don\u2019t have to ask what an \u201carchetype\u201d is or where the word comes from. That\u2019s when I\u2019ll be happy.<\/p>\n\n\n\n<p class=\"wp-block-paragraph\"><strong>Nik Lysytskiy:<\/strong>  Watch all our episodes \u2014 and you\u2019ll know exactly what an archetype is, and what each of the values we discuss truly means. I want to ask you about theater \u2014 specifically, the Theater of Personality. For you, is it a form of self-expression?<\/p>\n\n\n\n<p class=\"wp-block-paragraph\"><strong>Petro Maha:<\/strong> It\u2019s my lifelong love. Of course it\u2019s a form of self-expression. You know, there are performances where we invite people simply to laugh \u2014 because laughter is medicine. And that\u2019s important too.<\/p>\n\n\n\n<p class=\"wp-block-paragraph\">But you\u2019ve just asked me a really good question \u2014 I\u2019ll try to answer it properly. We often say people need to smile, to forget their troubles for a while. But theater, for me, is deeper than that. It\u2019s where we explore meaning.<\/p>\n\n\n\n<p class=\"wp-block-paragraph\">Take <em>Mykola Kulish\u2019s<\/em> play <em>Myna Mazaylo.<\/em> My character \u2014 Myna \u2014 is often portrayed as a fool who wants to change his Ukrainian surname to sound more Russian. But why does he want to do it? Because he\u2019s stupid? No. It\u2019s because he senses what\u2019s coming \u2014 he knows that people like him will soon be starved, shot, erased.<\/p>\n\n\n\n<p class=\"wp-block-paragraph\">He believes that by changing his name \u2014 to \u201cMazailov,\u201d to \u201cMazaylin\u201d \u2014 he might save himself and his family. He doesn\u2019t do it out of vanity, but out of fear. And he loves his son so much that he wants him to survive, even if it means rejecting their roots.<\/p>\n\n\n\n<p class=\"wp-block-paragraph\">So, I play a scoundrel who fights for the happiness of her children \u2014 a mother who rejects Ukrainian identity to protect her own blood. Almost no one stages <em>Myna Mazaylo<\/em> like that. Usually, it\u2019s simple \u2014 \u201che\u2019s an idiot,\u201d \u201cshe\u2019s hysterical.\u201d But that\u2019s not interesting. It\u2019s too easy.<\/p>\n\n\n\n<p class=\"wp-block-paragraph\">And then my daughter asked me one day \u2014 they call me \u201cnany\u201d at home, that\u2019s what they say in Transcarpathia \u2014 \u201cNany, why do we even do all this? You spend money on it, you chase people to come, you print tickets, you beg them to show up. Why bother?\u201d<\/p>\n\n\n\n<p class=\"wp-block-paragraph\">And I thought about it. And I realized \u2014 when a person leaves the theater after a performance, they don\u2019t want to punch anyone in the face for at least an hour or two. And that\u2019s already something.<\/p>\n\n\n\n<p class=\"wp-block-paragraph\">I believe that art should make people want to do something good, to be kind, to reflect \u2014 not to fight. For me, theater is a chance to make this world just a little better. And if I manage that, even in a small way, that\u2019s my contribution to the archetype of our nation.<\/p>\n\n\n\n<p class=\"wp-block-paragraph\">I live now in Khodosivka, near Kyiv \u2014 land that once belonged to the Kyiv-Pechersk Lavra. There are gardens, orchards, and sometimes we dig up ancient things from the soil \u2014 little clay figures, children\u2019s toys.<\/p>\n\n\n\n<p class=\"wp-block-paragraph\">I don\u2019t think the craftsman who made them imagined that in a thousand years, someone would dig them up and say, \u201cWow, what a great artist.\u201d No. He made them simply to bring joy to a child \u2014 his own, or someone else\u2019s.<\/p>\n\n\n\n<p class=\"wp-block-paragraph\">The same goes for the old crosses people wore \u2014 they didn\u2019t wear them for beauty, but because they believed the soul lived in the Cross.<\/p>\n\n\n\n<p class=\"wp-block-paragraph\">There\u2019s so much we don\u2019t know \u2014 and it\u2019s incredible. If people truly became interested in archetypes, in origins, in meanings, I\u2019d love to tell them even about the words we use every day. For example, where \u201cfor free\u201d came from.<\/p>\n\n\n\n<p class=\"wp-block-paragraph\">Everyone thinks it means \u201cwithout payment.\u201d But no \u2014 it comes from <em>\u201cfree\u201d<\/em> as in <em>\u201cFriday.\u201d<\/em> On Friday evening, when Shabbat began, Jewish milkmen would leave jugs of milk under the counter, saying \u201cfor free,\u201d meaning \u201cfor Friday.\u201d<\/p>\n\n\n\n<p class=\"wp-block-paragraph\">And that, again, tells something about us \u2014 about our shared history, about how deeply interconnected we all are.<\/p>\n\n\n\n<p class=\"wp-block-paragraph\">And no one stole anything. Everyone came and took only their own jug \u2014 but that evening, they didn\u2019t pay for it. Because everyone knew that the Jewish milkmen were in the synagogue at that moment, observing Shabbat, praying. They couldn\u2019t be disturbed.<\/p>\n\n\n\n<p class=\"wp-block-paragraph\">That\u2019s where the word <em>\u201cfor free\u201d<\/em> \u2014 or <em>\u201cfreebie\u201d<\/em> \u2014 comes from. They would leave the milk out \u201cfor free,\u201d meaning \u201cfor Friday.\u201d But the next day, you had to come back and pay for that \u201cfreebie.\u201d<\/p>\n\n\n\n<p class=\"wp-block-paragraph\">Who knows that now? Hardly anyone. You see, these things are deep \u2014 they need to be studied, explained, told. And I assure you, if you tell children stories like that, they\u2019ll be fascinated.<\/p>\n\n\n\n<p class=\"wp-block-paragraph\">For example, in our Historical Museum, there\u2019s a collection of bronze artifacts that were found on the Supii River. When they drained a canal there \u2014 it used to be a swamp \u2014 an ancient oak boat emerged from the mud. Inside it, they found a leather bag filled with bronze objects.<\/p>\n\n\n\n<p class=\"wp-block-paragraph\">I won\u2019t describe them all now \u2014 they can be seen once the war is over and the exhibits return \u2014 but they were made of bronze as thin as paper, unbelievably light. Dragon paws, griffin faces, intricate designs. People can\u2019t believe this could have been crafted without modern technology.<\/p>\n\n\n\n<p class=\"wp-block-paragraph\">Next to that bag lay the skeleton of a young man who had died in the boat \u2014 no signs of violence. Peaceful. And people just walk by these exhibits, barely looking. But when I tell them that this entire set weighs only a few dozen kilograms \u2014 and that the ancient Greeks would have given half their kingdom for such craftsmanship \u2014 their eyes light up. They ask, \u201cWhere can we see it?\u201d<\/p>\n\n\n\n<p class=\"wp-block-paragraph\">That\u2019s what we need \u2014 to be able to <em>talk<\/em> about it, to tell these stories vividly. To say, \u201cGuys, forget for a moment about America, England, or Spain \u2014 look at what <em>we<\/em> have!\u201d<\/p>\n\n\n\n<p class=\"wp-block-paragraph\">Look here \u2014 even our embroidery can be read like a text. You can tell from a pattern whether a woman was married, or single, or longing for love. Every stitch carries meaning.<\/p>\n\n\n\n<p class=\"wp-block-paragraph\">That\u2019s what I stand for \u2014 appreciating the real treasures we have, and passing them on to the generations that come after us.<\/p>\n\n\n\n<p class=\"wp-block-paragraph\"><strong>Nik Lysytskiy:<\/strong>  And now, it\u2019s time for our traditional game with the guest \u2014 our folklore chest. And today, inside the folklore chest \u2014 we have songs. Here\u2019s the task: I\u2019ll read the first line of a folk verse, and you have to come up with the ending. Shall we play?<\/p>\n\n\n\n<p class=\"wp-block-paragraph\"><strong>Petro Maha:<\/strong> Something unusual?<\/p>\n\n\n\n<p class=\"wp-block-paragraph\"><strong>Nik Lysytskiy:<\/strong>  You can be creative \u2014 you probably know the original endings, so make up your own. Here\u2019s the first one: \u201cOh, someone\u2019s horse is standing there, like a gray hryvnia.\u201d<\/p>\n\n\n\n<p class=\"wp-block-paragraph\"><strong>Petro Maha:<\/strong> The Ukrainian version was, \u201cZubamy klatsaye\u201d \u2014 \u201cIt\u2019s clattering its teeth.\u201d I liked it, and I was still a little girl then. It\u2019s a classic song \u2014 very beautiful.<\/p>\n\n\n\n<p class=\"wp-block-paragraph\"><strong>Nik Lysytskiy:<\/strong>  \u201cThe thorn blossoms, the thorn blossoms, and the blossom falls.\u201d<\/p>\n\n\n\n<p class=\"wp-block-paragraph\"><strong>Petro Maha:<\/strong>  Oh, he who doesn\u2019t know love, doesn\u2019t know joy or sorrow. Or maybe: \u201cThe thorn blossoms, the thorn blossoms, and the blossom falls \u2014 autumn will come, let\u2019s wait, together we\u2019ll reap a good harvest.\u201d Something like that.<\/p>\n\n\n\n<p class=\"wp-block-paragraph\"><strong>Nik Lysytskiy:<\/strong>  \u201cYou said we\u2019d go pick periwinkles together on Monday.\u201d<\/p>\n\n\n\n<p class=\"wp-block-paragraph\"><strong>Petro Maha:<\/strong>  \u201cWhat the hell do I need periwinkle for?\u201d I asked on Monday.<\/p>\n\n\n\n<p class=\"wp-block-paragraph\"><strong>Nik Lysytskiy:<\/strong>  \u201cGalya carries water, the yoke bends.\u201d<\/p>\n\n\n\n<p class=\"wp-block-paragraph\"><strong>Petro Maha:<\/strong>  Well, that\u2019s definitely not happening in Donetsk!<\/p>\n\n\n\n<p class=\"wp-block-paragraph\"><strong>Nik Lysytskiy:<\/strong>  \u201cOh, in the grove by the Danube, there\u2019s music playing.\u201d<\/p>\n\n\n\n<p class=\"wp-block-paragraph\"><strong>Petro Maha:<\/strong>  And on stage, Mila sings that song to Job! By the way, that\u2019s true \u2014 she always performs it at her concerts.<\/p>\n\n\n\n<p class=\"wp-block-paragraph\"><strong>Nik Lysytskiy:<\/strong>  That exact song?<\/p>\n\n\n\n<p class=\"wp-block-paragraph\"><strong>Petro Maha:<\/strong>  Yes, that exact one.<\/p>\n\n\n\n<p class=\"wp-block-paragraph\"><strong>Nik Lysytskiy:<\/strong>  Alright then, let\u2019s move on to our Blitz round \u2014 seven quick questions, seven short (or maybe not-so-short) answers. What quality do you value most in people?<\/p>\n\n\n\n<p class=\"wp-block-paragraph\"><strong>Petro Maha:<\/strong>  Intelligence.<\/p>\n\n\n\n<p class=\"wp-block-paragraph\"><strong>Nik Lysytskiy:<\/strong>  And which quality do you think is the worst?<\/p>\n\n\n\n<p class=\"wp-block-paragraph\"><strong>Petro Maha:<\/strong> Bombast.<\/p>\n\n\n\n<p class=\"wp-block-paragraph\"><strong>Nik Lysytskiy:<\/strong>  What inspires you?<\/p>\n\n\n\n<p class=\"wp-block-paragraph\"><strong>Petro Maha:<\/strong>  Right now \u2014 my grandson, Orest.<\/p>\n\n\n\n<p class=\"wp-block-paragraph\"><strong>Nik Lysytskiy:<\/strong>  What scares you?<\/p>\n\n\n\n<p class=\"wp-block-paragraph\"><strong>Petro Maha:<\/strong>  Uncertainty.<\/p>\n\n\n\n<p class=\"wp-block-paragraph\"><strong>Nik Lysytskiy:<\/strong>  What helped you get through the hardest moments in life?<\/p>\n\n\n\n<p class=\"wp-block-paragraph\"><strong>Petro Maha:<\/strong>  Stubbornness.<\/p>\n\n\n\n<p class=\"wp-block-paragraph\"><strong>Nik Lysytskiy:<\/strong>  And what\u2019s the main goal or mission of your life?<\/p>\n\n\n\n<p class=\"wp-block-paragraph\"><strong>Petro Maha:<\/strong>  So that in a hundred years, people will say, \u201cThat guy was cool.\u201d<\/p>\n\n\n\n<p class=\"wp-block-paragraph\"><strong>Nik Lysytskiy:<\/strong>  If you had to choose three words to describe Ukrainians, what would they be?<\/p>\n\n\n\n<p class=\"wp-block-paragraph\"><strong>Petro Maha:<\/strong>  The people who can.<\/p>\n\n\n\n<p class=\"wp-block-paragraph\"><strong>Nik Lysytskiy:<\/strong>  Thank you. And now, in our \u201cArtifact\u201d segment \u2014 a book by Petro Maha, <em>Poems from the Trenches.<\/em> You wrote this book in 2023, right?<\/p>\n\n\n\n<p class=\"wp-block-paragraph\"><strong>Petro Maha:<\/strong> Yes. It started in 2022 \u2014 the first edition was finished within the first four months of the war. It was all written in a kind of wild shock. Later, when there were more poems, we decided to republish it. My friend, Dmytro Oliinyk, helped me \u2014 huge thanks to him. I had no trouble getting it reprinted. That\u2019s how the book came to be.<\/p>\n\n\n\n<p class=\"wp-block-paragraph\"><strong>Nik Lysytskiy:<\/strong>  Is it documentary poetry about the war? How are these texts born? Because that\u2019s also a form of self-expression \u2014 is it reflection, a way to cope with emotions, or a desire to make a statement?<\/p>\n\n\n\n<p class=\"wp-block-paragraph\"><strong>Petro Maha:<\/strong> It\u2019s everything I\u2019ve mentioned today \u2014 stubbornness, resilience, expression. I had this dream that someone could open the book on any page and instantly remember what happened that day.<\/p>\n\n\n\n<p class=\"wp-block-paragraph\">Let\u2019s do an experiment. Name any page number.<\/p>\n\n\n\n<p class=\"wp-block-paragraph\"><strong>Nik Lysytskiy:<\/strong>  Twenty-seven.<\/p>\n\n\n\n<p class=\"wp-block-paragraph\"><strong>Petro Maha:<\/strong> Twenty-seven? Let\u2019s see\u2026 Page twenty-seven \u2014 this one\u2019s an appeal to the Kuban Cossacks. It\u2019s a unique poem because each line alternates between Ukrainian and Russian \u2014 that\u2019s how people live there, half-and-half.<\/p>\n\n\n\n<p class=\"wp-block-paragraph\">The language is mixed, the people are mixed \u2014 and that\u2019s the tragedy. I won\u2019t read it all, but it begins:<\/p>\n\n\n\n<p class=\"wp-block-paragraph\">\u201cDo you like it, Tsar?<br>Have your problems gone away?<br>Do you like it that way, Tsar?<br>You can\u2019t build peace on blood.\u201d<\/p>\n\n\n\n<p class=\"wp-block-paragraph\">It\u2019s about those Cossacks who committed atrocities \u2014 and for me, that was a shock, because most of them are of Ukrainian origin.<\/p>\n\n\n\n<p class=\"wp-block-paragraph\">I have poems here about the shootings, about Macijevskyi, about everything \u2014 even one about the raccoon stolen from the Kherson Zoo that ended up in Yalta with Comrade Zubkov.<\/p>\n\n\n\n<p class=\"wp-block-paragraph\">There are terrible things \u2014 Kramatorsk station, missile strikes in Odesa, Kharkiv, Sumy, the ships with grain sunk, the bombing of Ohmatdyt hospital. But there are also moments of light \u2014 like that girl who kept making coffee in a shattered caf\u00e9. Our people are like that \u2014 unbreakable.<\/p>\n\n\n\n<p class=\"wp-block-paragraph\">I want the book to smell like courage and hope.<\/p>\n\n\n\n<p class=\"wp-block-paragraph\"><strong>Nik Lysytskiy:<\/strong>  I can\u2019t help but ask \u2014 you also create theater projects that involve war veterans. What does art, and the opportunity for self-expression, give to those returning from the front?<\/p>\n\n\n\n<p class=\"wp-block-paragraph\"><strong>Petro Maha:<\/strong> You know, it\u2019s not easy. It\u2019s about helping them return to life. On February 22, 2022, we gathered at my house to plan a play about ATO soldiers. We invited real heroes \u2014 the people whose stories the play would be based on.<\/p>\n\n\n\n<p class=\"wp-block-paragraph\">One of them was the now-legendary commander of the Legion of Freedom, Petro Kozyk \u2014 I still have the phonograph he gifted me. Another was a soldier with the call sign \u201cCanada\u201d \u2014 a Ukrainian who had joined the fight through sheer will.<\/p>\n\n\n\n<p class=\"wp-block-paragraph\">If someone had told us that in just two days, a full-scale invasion would begin, none of us would\u2019ve believed it. So now it\u2019s very, very hard.<\/p>\n\n\n\n<p class=\"wp-block-paragraph\">Almost all our work with veterans comes down to one principle \u2014 they can attend all our shows and events for free. Because taking money from soldiers is wrong.<\/p>\n\n\n\n<p class=\"wp-block-paragraph\"><strong>Nik Lysytskiy:<\/strong>  Thank you.<\/p>\n\n\n\n<p class=\"wp-block-paragraph\">Friends, today in the studio we had People\u2019s Artist of Ukraine, poet, and TV host Petro Maha. Tell us in the comments what stood out most to you today.<\/p>\n\n\n\n<p class=\"wp-block-paragraph\">Do you think self-expression is one of the key values inherent to the Ukrainian people? Share your reflections and discoveries after watching or listening to this episode.<\/p>\n\n\n\n<p class=\"wp-block-paragraph\">A reminder \u2014 you can watch episodes of the \u201cArchetype of the Nation\u201d project on YouTube, listen to them on your favorite podcast platforms, and read them on the website <strong>magicworld.com.ua<\/strong>. There you\u2019ll also find popular science essays by folklorist Maryna Demediuk and recordings of folklore works performed by well-known actors.<\/p>\n\n\n\n<p class=\"wp-block-paragraph\">Thank you for your attention \u2014 and see you next time.<\/p>\n","protected":false},"excerpt":{"rendered":"<p>Guest of the episode: Petro Maha \u2014 Ukrainian People\u2019s Artist, poet, and television host. 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